Illinois National Guard begins to push back against illegal Trump deployment
by Brian Tyler Cohen and Glenn Kirschner
Brian Tyler Cohen News
Oct 7, 2025 Legal Breakdown
Legal Breakdown: Illinois National Guard begins to push back against illegal Trump deployment
Transcript
You're watching the legal breakdown.
Glenn, we have a really really important
development here. You and I have spoken
at length about what happens in the
event that Donald Trump asks troops or
law enforcement to uh to carry out some
some action that's illegal or that runs
counter to their oath of office. We now
have the first instance where it seems
like we're actually butdding up against
that reality. Can you explain what
happened in Illinois? Yeah, Brian, a
really important development because as
an old army guy myself, we are taught
that we must obey lawful orders, but
even more importantly, we must disobey
unlawful orders, patently unlawful
orders. And we have not heard any
rumblings from the military that they
have been disregarding or refusing to
obey anything Trump has told them to do,
including, you know, blowing Venezuelan
boats out of international waters, which
clearly violates every law known to man,
domestic law, international law, and
military law, or the law of war. Well,
what we now have is an attempt by Donald
Trump to federalize the Illinois State
National Guard. And we may have just
seen our first military push back. I
want to read a quote from some brand new
reporting. The governor did not receive
any calls from any federal officials. A
statement from Illinois Governor JB
Pritsker's office read, quote, "The
Illinois National Guard communicated to
the Department of War, that's the
Department of Defense, that the
situation in Illinois does not require
the use of the military and as a result,
the governor opposes the deployment of
the National Guard under any status."
Close quote. Brian, that's huge. I'm not
going to say this is a turning point,
although we'll see how history records
it. But, you know, remember when he
unlawfully federalized the California
National Guard and he refused to go
through Governor Nuome's office as the
law requires him to do. What happened?
Well, the California National Guard was
federalized and deployed to the streets
of Los Angeles. It looks like Illinois
is taking another approach. They're
saying no. the situation doesn't warrant
it. You did not go through the
governor's office as the law requires
and there is no factual basis to
federalize the Illinois State National
Guard. So, as of right now, and these
are rapidly developing facts and
circumstances, as of right now, it looks
like we have our first significant
military push back and we'll see, you
know, what happens moving forward.
Glenn, what happens practically
speaking? Like, I understand that you
and I can talk about, okay, you can, you
know, disobey uh an unlawful order, but
it it's easy to say that from where we
sit, from behind computer screens,
whatever it may be. When you're like,
practically speaking, when you're faced
with the prospect of following an
illegal order that was inherently given
to you by somebody higher up, isn't it
more difficult to just say no to that
person than we're kind of giving them
credit for? So what happens like in
these real life scenarios where they
actually are given an unconstitutional
illegal or unlawful order by somebody
who's their superior. I'm assuming it's
not just that easy to disregard that
order. And so what happens in these
instances? So, first of all, I was an
army JAG and part of my responsibilities
included not only prosecuting court
marshal cases when soldiers would
violate the law um whether they were
military offenses or civilian type
offenses, you know, murder, rape, theft,
those are civilian type offenses. And um
disobeying a lawful order, you know,
going awall absent absent without leave,
you know, there were sort of um uniquely
military offenses, too. But the other
thing I did was I gave commanders advice
on, for example, what orders are lawful
and what orders are not lawful. And now
to answer your question, it's not easy.
It's not easy for a military member who
is trained to obey the commands, the
orders given by their superiors. It's
not easy for them to say, you know,
captain, major, colonel, general, I
cannot comply with that order because
it's not lawful. But here's the thing,
Brian. Nobody said military service was
easy. Nobody said it was going to be
easy to support and defend the
Constitution against all enemies,
foreign and especially domestic. But
nothing is more important than that oath
every single member of the military
takes. So whereas it might be hard,
nothing, especially at at this moment in
our nation's history, nothing could be
more important than service members
obeying the laws and standing up um in
the event there is an unlawful order
given. Now, I want to talk about what's
happening in Chicago right now because
we've already seen that an analogous uh
situation when he deployed these troops
in Los Angeles that was shut down by a
judge because um his deployment didn't
satisfy any of the three thresholds that
needed to be met, which is that there
was uh an an insurrection or rebellion.
There was no invasion. There was no
failure of the local government to be
able to effectuate its laws. The same
thing happened in Oregon where we just
had a judge uh in Oregon block Trump's
deployment there. uh because again these
three thresholds, none of those were
met. And so I'm assuming he's going to
try and do the same thing in Chicago
here and claim that there was some
failure of the local government to be
able to effectuate its laws or that
there was some invasion or insurrection
or rebellion there. We we've seen in
instance after instance that Trump's not
able to meet this bar. And so and so
what happens next as far as Chicago's is
concerned and and I guess moreover
beyond that what happens to the people
that he tries to deploy there knowing
that there's no basis to do so.
All good questions and none of it has a
clear answer. I assume what Donald Trump
will do is he will either send a
message, a missive, a threat to
Illinois, to the governor and to the uh
National Guard, the state national guard
that you better do this now or there's
going to be hell to pay. I hope Illinois
uh stands strong and refuses to give in
to Donald Trump's lawlessness, be
bullied into changing course now that
they've taken a stand. Um, and then the
next thing Donald Trump could perhaps do
is just go ahead and send, you know,
actual military troops, army, air force,
you know, navy, marines, uh, into
Chicago, into Illinois, which, you know,
would also inspire instant legal
challenges. And let let's talk about
what we are facing right now. Here's the
backdrop against which this battle in
Illinois is being fought and is
unfolding. After the judge issued a
temporary restraining order in Portland,
Oregon, a Trump appointed judge, I might
add, because the judge concluded that
Donald Trump's actions are untethered to
facts, to reality. What did Donald Trump
do? He ordered the California National
Guard, which is still apparently
federalized, to go to Portland. I mean,
if that is not a direct violation of
probably the rights of the California
National Guard, but even setting that
aside, it clearly violates in substance
and in spirit the temporary restraining
order that the federal judge in Oregon
just issued. You know, this makes Donald
Trump, you know, we've heard of serial
killers, a serial violator of the
Constitution and of court orders. You
know, it seems like he's trying to bring
our American crisis to a head but quick.
And I don't think any of this will serve
him well, particularly against another
important backdrop, Brian, when he and
Pete Hegsth addressed all of the
military's commanders and treated them
like they were, you know, middle school
students who knew nothing about military
service, who knew nothing about the oath
that they take of loyalty to the
Constitution, not to a tyrant, a
dictator, or an autocrat. I actually
think that may have galvanized the
military against Donald Trump's
lawlessness because it was on full
display that Donald Trump is completely
unfit to be commanderin-chief of the
armed forces. When he tells the military
leadership things like, "I want you to
use American cities as military training
grounds." What does that mean? The
military trains to fight and win wars
and kill the enemy in the process. And
Donald Trump told those military
commanders, "That's what I want you to
do in American cities and he added that
the American people are the enemy from
within." It doesn't surprise me that
right after that horrific address to the
troops, we now have for the first time
some military faction, the Illinois
State National Guard, standing up,
pushing back, and apparently telling
Donald Trump and his Secretary of
Defense, "No."
Well, look, this isn't uh out of
character for Trump. We learned from his
former Secretary of Defense, Mark Esper,
in his first term that he wanted to
shoot protesters in the leg. These are
people exercising their first amendment
rights. And so this is just the natural
progression for someone who views
himself as a wartime president. But the
enemy as far as Trump is concerned is
Americans. And like you know I I mean
that through the looking glass is the
only thing I can say as far as that's
concerned. This is obviously a
continuing a story that's continuing to
develop. So for those who are watching,
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Taylor Cohen.
And I'm Glenn Kersner.
You're watching the Legal Breakdown.
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