Re: Charles Carreon: Popehat.com, by Kenneth Paul White
Posted: Mon Jan 06, 2014 11:43 pm
PART 3 OF 7 (The Oatmeal v. FunnyJunk, Part X: Philanthropy > Douchebaggery Cont'd)
Mike K • Jul 11, 2012 @6:06 pm I was figuring that by 'Wikipedia Clique' he was referring to the editors that were going to delete his page. I'm assuming they'll be renewing that discussion again shortly, unless he does something so worthy of scorn as to merit it on his wikipedia page and saving it for a while.
n o 0 n e • Jul 11, 2012 @6:10 pm @W Ross
thank you for introducing me to Professor Elemental. despite my love for hip-hop and things with a wodehousian flair i was unaware of this fine gentlemen or the expressive genre known as 'chap-hop' that so effusively combines the two.
upon my sam, i am in your debt.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 11, 2012 @6:10 pm T.J: Because they don't have Arizona council.
Carreon is very good (and probably right, actually, in this case) at fighting jurisdictional claims. The RIAA would need to sue in Arizona or California, or Carreon would tie them up forever in court on jurisdiction (Penguin v American Buddha is still in the appeals process over just that issue).
Myk • Jul 11, 2012 @6:34 pm @T.J @Nicholas – It would be fun, though, if RIAA were to launch a raid akin to the Kim Dotcom one- armed agents rappelling from helicopters etc. I would pay money to see the look on Tara's face when that one goes down! I realise it'll never happen, but one can daydream…
Chris R. • Jul 11, 2012 @6:45 pm @Myk, that would probably be tragic because if she still owns her firearms she'd begin firing on police and they'd respond in suit.
Chris R. • Jul 11, 2012 @6:56 pm Charles is going full Tara right now on Rapeutation.com adding pages and names by the buttload.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 11, 2012 @7:18 pm Wow, Charles just went off the deep end here:
Paul Alan Levy, an attorney at Public Citizen Group who is said to be “an expert in issues of Internet free speech, removal jurisdiction, and the representation of ‘lawyers in trouble’ from sanctions, contempt findings and the like,” has sued me on behalf of a “Doe Plaintiff” who, so I hear from third-hand sources, is alleged to be the registrant of Charles-Carreon.com. (For the record – I have never read one line of the complaint.) Paul looks entirely sane, so we can only conclude that the smell of oatmeal is more intoxicating than it might seem. Freedom of speech is at stake! Aux les barricades!
You would think he'd actually read the complaint by now.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 11, 2012 @7:20 pm Oh, and he edits as I read!
Of course, the real question is, will Paul represent Mr. Recovreur if Walgreens fires him for unauthorized use of his workplace computer? Paul looks entirely sane, so we can only conclude that the smell of oatmeal is more intoxicating than it might seem.
Chris R. • Jul 11, 2012 @7:37 pm Lol. 2 blog posts a day = has to use work computer? It must take him a real long time to write things down.
Mike K • Jul 11, 2012 @7:37 pm I expect Ken will be listed eventually. You should write your own paragraph and send it to him. Then you can practice your snark and and save him a few hours of research.
I notice that other than a few grammar mistakes that he's being very careful about what he writes. He's avoiding anything that could be remotely considered defamatory, although it's pretty bad that he'd mention someone's wife as part of his 'war' despite her presumably not mentioning his name ever.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 11, 2012 @7:44 pm Mike K: Yeah.
And hey, it IS protected, he can rant and rave as much as he wants. Its amusing to a large degree, but by the same token we can taunt him and taunt him and taunt him…
The "at work" comment even can probably be classed as opinion, and therefore protected. Just because the Real Chuckles may think it takes 4 billable hours to do a post (lawyers work slow, especially when they are happy things don't settle because it gives them a chance to bond with their clients and bill them more!), doesn't mean Satirical Charles does.
Ann • Jul 11, 2012 @7:49 pm Yeah. So any pity that may have been seeding itself in my southern sensibilities for that piece of shit just got squished w/ the mention of Chris' wife. The only members of the Carreon clan that have been discussed have been those who have inserted themselves into the conversation.
Referring to this as a war is preposterous. That said, it is now on like Donkey Kong.
Marzipan • Jul 11, 2012 @7:54 pm Indeed, Ann. Seems like he's trying to drag in the family of all his critics as he views his family as having been dragged in.
Truth be told, I'm surprised he hasn't included you for being…what was it, the "Lying Little Bitch"?…who started another fundraiser with the explicit purpose of demonstrating FU is a perfectly legitimate reason for donating money. Who else here will end up on his hit list…err…"Rapeutationers" list?
joe • Jul 11, 2012 @7:55 pm Nicholas, Ann, where is he posting this – can you provide the link?
Shannon Lynch • Jul 11, 2012 @7:58 pm http://rapeutation.com/2012/07/12/the-rapeutationists/
Adam Steinbaugh • Jul 11, 2012 @8:00 pm I'm not surprised by the creepiness of bringing in Chris' wife. When Carreon and I talked via Twitter DMs, he asked me if I had any allegiances, claiming he didn't have time to research me. A few minutes later, he asked what a particular professor I'd worked for (on First Amendment issues) would say about his case. I checked my IP logs and confirmed that he had downloaded my resume. So much for having no time to research.
Elegy • Jul 11, 2012 @8:00 pm Yeah, I can't find the list of enemies from his main site, all links appear to have been taken off. Perhaps you guys are reading something he thinks is protected?
Link Please!
Elegy • Jul 11, 2012 @8:00 pm In late, sorry, thanks for the link.
Marzipan • Jul 11, 2012 @8:05 pm @Adam, yeesh. Sounds like he's been doing the Creep. I wish he would have taken his own advice: "Might have a career ahead of him if he learns that the smell of fecal matter is actually a warning of potential toxicity, not a signal to drive your snout deeply into the source of the aroma."
Then again, after lying around in it for decades, I'm sure his intellectual sniffer has habituated to the stink of fetid arguments, no matter how forcefully he advances them.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 11, 2012 @8:05 pm Adam: Hey, look at it this way, you're first on Carreon's parade, you should be honored!
I'm dissapointed, all my PACER money and, for what, cool quotes like
Far from being worried, Mr. Carreon stated that he was pleased that negotiations had not proved successful because it allowed him to “bond with [his] clients and get more money out of them.”
(Declaration of ROBERT L. LOMBARDO, in Global Innovations, Inc. et al v. ALS Scan, Inc. et al)
Ann • Jul 11, 2012 @8:07 pm @Adam – he's back on Twitter?????
Adam Steinbaugh • Jul 11, 2012 @8:10 pm @Ann: no, this was when he originally filed against Inman. He had followed me on Twitter, so I DM'd him asking for a copy of the complaint. He didn't oblige.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 11, 2012 @8:13 pm Oh, adam, Carreon's claiming to have evidence of an evil DOS attack on him:
http://rapeutation.com/evidence-of-dos-attacks/
Elegy • Jul 11, 2012 @8:14 pm And…. I found the link to that post – got a little over excited at the douchebaggery there, won't happen again.
What is bizarre to me is this: from its initial launch, I thought "Rapeutation.com" was going to be Charles way of introducing a serious discussion of what he (perceived) to be the faults of current tort law – despite the bizarre fonts and colors, and distinct lack of capitalization in his "legal analysis".
Instead, he's sunk to extremely personal attacks against the people he thinks are after him in something like 72-hours or less. This only serves to undercut any high ground he could hope to hold, and it reveals his douchebaggery in all its glory. This guy is a foot-shot Olympian.
I'm just waiting on him to start jumping on 4chan. They were on his list of rapeutationists earlier. Hopefully they'll jump up and down on him instead. (Ok, on second thought, I wouldn't wish that on anyone)
Adam Steinbaugh • Jul 11, 2012 @8:23 pm @Nicholas: I saw. I'm waiting for something to get posted. If he's right, then he's right. I've already said that if those kinds of attacks are happening, then that's despicable.
Say, you have a tech background, yes?
@Elegy: indeed. Here I thought he might use the site to bring a unique perspective on how we should approach the First Amendment in the Internet context. Then again, the site's name is a rape pun playing off of reputation.com.
W Ross • Jul 11, 2012 @8:27 pm Wow….
The Carreons are the Endboss of the Internet.
I never thought I'd see it in my day…
Ken • Jul 11, 2012 @8:28 pm I'm betting that I find out that I'm bald and fat, and possibly stupid.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 11, 2012 @8:28 pm Adam: Yeah. Ph.D. Computer Science, specializing in network measurement and network security.
If it is an actual DOS, rather than a flashcrowd and curious people hitting reload, that his system is back up says its just some script kiddies with something like LOIC, which means if it is a real DOS, he could probably track them down pretty easily because anyone who would do such a weak-sauce DOS is probably stupid enough to do it from their own home system.
And I would be willing to help him on that, on a pro bono basis. Even reprehensible douchebags deserve free speech rights on their own site.
Ken • Jul 11, 2012 @8:30 pm Agreed. A DOS is not free speech. I have zero problem with douchebags doing that being outed, tracked down, and reported to anyone who will listen.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 11, 2012 @8:34 pm ken: I suspect Carreon won't be so classy. Expect something dissing your family. That seems more his style.
Oh, and Adam, he's surprised people notice him!
Almost immediately after I posted this comment on July 11, 2012, Adam responded with a tweet that appeared on his own blog, posting a link back here. The dynamics of DIRAs generate strange attractors.
Adam Steinbaugh • Jul 11, 2012 @8:41 pm I confess that I'm not nearly nerdy enough to understand what that means.
(not the DOS description — that I understand crystal clear, and I join in your offer to help track down the malcontents.)
Elegy • Jul 11, 2012 @8:43 pm @Adam
You're right, I should have said multiple foot-shot champion. He was sunk from the point he picked the domain name.
I was hoping that the mudwrestling comment was signaling the "aw shucks, let's let bygone be bygones/we were all just kidding" phase. Instead, the man starts piling on the crazy, Tara style. Good god.
I wasn't really ready to buy into the "conflating rape with what he's going through" argument at first – I just figured it was evidence of poor taste and little thought on his part.
But damned if I don't buy it now. I think the man's butthurt has gotten so bad, it is evident that he really feels he is being "raped".
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 11, 2012 @8:45 pm Translation:
"Script Kiddies": Think the cliche pimply-faced asshole living in Mama's basement. Cliche, but true. Tends to use off the shelf tools (scripts), thus the derogatory term.
LOIC: "Low Orbit Ion Cannon": "Anonymous's" simple DDoS tool, but it by default is running from the user's computer. Thus its pretty easy to track down who's using it.
Grifter • Jul 11, 2012 @8:47 pm Wait, Adam, were you questioning the DOS stuff, or the strange attractor accusation?
W Ross • Jul 11, 2012 @8:48 pm @Ken
"In the "Legal Analysis" he says: denial of service attacks (my network has suffered three major dos attacks, and i have quadrupled my server space, at considerable cost, simply to stay online) or other digital trespasses to chattels"
Now go and look at the Nader Library thread here:
http://www.naderlibrary.com/bulletin_bo ... m.php?f=24
And note the 100,000 reads she's gotten in just the first two articles. If he's got DOS stuff then yeah, release it and throw the book. But I'm guessing his sites went down on high traffic and he had to pay to go to some next tier or something before they turned them back on- counting to him as the site being knocked off line.
In that case, it's the salacious speech that's causing the traffic, not somebody firing mad packets at it. That's my guess.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 11, 2012 @8:51 pm W Ross: That's my bet too.
The failures have been "Can't connect to database" in some cases, and his main site (the CharlesCarreon domain also hosts rapeutation and his other wonders. But its all database driven, and probably on a pretty dinky VM hosting through BlueHost. And it attracts a lot more traffic than he was used to.
Adam Steinbaugh • Jul 11, 2012 @8:51 pm Oh, no, I get the DOS stuff Weaver's talking about. I used to do some low-level network security stuff for MySpace.
The strange attractor thing, complete with link to this page… no idea.
Grifter • Jul 11, 2012 @8:54 pm @Adam Steinbaugh:
It's a chaos theory thing (that he's misusing). A strange attractor is a point in an equation that other data points "sort of" circle around, causing a sort of linked-looking eddy thing (I'm being very technical), and I believe he's saying you are linked to him like a strange attractor in a system.
He is undoubtedly picturing something like this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lorenz_system
Grifter • Jul 11, 2012 @8:55 pm …which is on the page he linked, if I'd actually read it. I guess he's saying you're his other butterfly wing. It's a…compliment?
Elegy • Jul 11, 2012 @9:00 pm @Adam
That's chaos theory stuff, ever popular with hippies and graduate students who subsist on too much postmodernism. Put simply, it's a point in n-space (or the complex plane, etc) about which certain equations exhibit certain kinds of behavior.
It's difficult to explain in layman's terms and no math, which is why I'm betting Carreon is just using a buzz word. Whatever he thinks it means, it doesn't. But I have no idea what he thinks it means.
Robert White • Jul 11, 2012 @9:06 pm Plus, the whole "butterfly" thing was disproved because of the failure of the "initial condition" hypothesis. That is, the chaos butterfly works only if the universe is static as the initial condition, but because the universe isn't static when the flapping happens, no "resultant" storm.
I'm no math wiz, but I love it when people who are -wholly- clueless use the words to steal cachet.
also, "DOS" my ass, they just aren't used to having anything they said actually read. e.g. "toh noes, someone hit my site, I must be under attack!".
W Ross • Jul 11, 2012 @9:06 pm @Nicholas Weaver Cool, so it's not me. Cause that's a LOT of traffic for a month on a site that gets no traffic. My bet is they were coasting along on a very inexpensive plan, then their sites got popular and the costs went up.
If he's got evidence, he'll show his hand; real evidence of a DOS is usually pretty concrete unless it's sophisticated (in my understanding.)
@noOne You're welcome. Always good to keep a little Chap Hop in your trouser pocket.
@all
/sets up soapbox
OK so we're kind of through the Looking Glass here folks. I want to say here and now that anybody who suddenly goes Anonymous, shuts up, or heads off; I don't blame ya and do what you gotta. Shit is getting real when people start mentioning family members of press and commenters.
If you stay, and if you have a web presence, the Carreon's may subject you to embarrassing disclosures. They may make generalized statements about you in print, or contact your friends and family. They may photoshop a murder of dicks on your forehead (yes, they're like crows.)
If you stay I can't promise you victory… I can't promise you safety, or a delicious ham sandwich… But I can promise you one thing…
lulz.
Dozens and dozens of delightful, memorable, once in a lifetime lulz as you and your newfound friends are viciously attacked by Bellatrix Lestrange and Stephen Segal's half-brother in the most public, failure ridden way possible. You will laugh like you haven't laughed before, and then you will laugh again, because Tara will edit and repost the thing you just laughed at, making it hilarious.
And you'll probably get sued.
So if I never see you again, know I thought you fought bravely on the fields of hilarity, and I was proud to know you.
But if you stay… well, again, probably dicks right on your face.
But it will be funny.
(*required music https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XZIEBZsV9hk )
Ann • Jul 11, 2012 @9:07 pm If he's having database connection issues, could be SQL injection. The Nader Library site is very late nineties in construction and aesthetics. Is it a leap to think the site was utilizing inline selection statements prior to the "attacks" and then some poor website admin had to convert them to stored procedures? SQL injection could be purposeful, or it could be cropping up in the "bot-ish" version now that the site is more easily crawlable with all the inbound links?
W Ross • Jul 11, 2012 @9:11 pm http://rapeutation.com/2012/07/12/hate-emails/
A new section. So you don't "DOS" him with hits, here's the full text so far. Busy little bees, they. This ought to be a night.
"As a Rapeutation gets going, many minor league Rapeutationists start to send hate emails. What is the effect of receiving hate emails, you might ask? It depends upon a lot of things. In The Sex.Com Chronicles, I described the anxiety caused by receiving scary faxes (the instant-delivery technology of the day), and you might think hate emails would cause the same response. But they don’t. As I received and read a few hundred hate emails, I experienced a range of responses. I was mostly amused, occasionally challenged, rarely annoyed, and in the aggregate, somewhat saddened.
Amused because although the writers were familiar with my name, they didn’t know me, so much of what they said seemed silly and misdirected. Challenged when the writer raised a relevant point that seemed worthy of a response. Annoyed for a range of reasons that all amounted one thing — I had let them get under my skin. Saddened because so many people had the time spit bile at me, over a legal spat about comic websites, while the world is literally burning up around us, while American-made drones hunt humans like video-game targets on the other side of the world, while migrants struggle through the desert a few miles south of here in the Sonora desert, just trying to make it to a place where they can have a decent living. In that context, wasting time hatemailing me seemed like a terrible waste of mental energy. But I digress. This post is to give you access to some of the hatemails I received, to put names to some of the hatemailers, and allow you, dear reader, a view into the workings of a DIRA.
THIS PAGE IS NOW UNDER CONSTRUCTION
PREVIOUS : The Rapeutationists"
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 11, 2012 @9:15 pm Ann: Nah. Naderlibrary/american-buddha are hosted on a different server from Charles's "professional" sites. Its the raputation professional site and the other professional sites that have been having issues today.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 11, 2012 @9:18 pm Oh, and if I do get sued, for expressing my constitutionally protected opinions and right to search and publish public records, let it be known I will make sure that the words "Snort my taint" end up in the legal record for the case.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 11, 2012 @9:19 pm Robert: Of course, the goal is to find the butterfly thats causing all the bad weather and KILL IT!
Mike K • Jul 11, 2012 @9:20 pm "while the world is literally burning up"
I loled when I read this on his site.
I have minimal web presence Ross, so I have severe doubts they'll find me without latching onto some other random person. I may do website work, but I'm somewhat anti-social and have a tendency to reveal vague details that don't identify me when online.
W Ross • Jul 11, 2012 @9:22 pm You know that part where the hero rides in on the horse made of Internets?
https://twitter.com/wilw/status/223270342708305920
Well now you do.
Welcome to thunderdome, motherfather. Treebeard just stood up, and he's pissed about how you're treatin' his forest.
(Told you there'd be lulz.)
Tali • Jul 11, 2012 @9:23 pm @W Ross
A Citizen Kane style applause for your soapbox preaching.
http://thumbs.newschoolers.com/index.ph ... /&size=400×1000
I feel like I've missed a lot in the time I've been AFK, but I guess having a baby (and forgetting to pay the internet bill in the process) will do that to you
Now that I'm back, I'm totally with you. I'm in it for the lulz!
W Ross • Jul 11, 2012 @9:25 pm Then remember that part of the movie where yet another hero takes notice?
https://twitter.com/doctorow/status/223270690609053696
>:D
YA DONE GOOFED!
Wil • Jul 11, 2012 @9:29 pm As a professional SQL geek, from what I can tell the Nader Library website is patched and not vulnerable to SQL injection. It's not intentional…they just lucked out. I've done a decent amount of intrusion testing for SQL injection and later versions of most forum software (Vbulletin, PHPbb, etc.) are relatively immune.
W Ross • Jul 11, 2012 @9:32 pm @Wil Nice, so that base is covered.
http://imgur.com/z8182
I got the photo of the site uploaded so they can't delete their way out of it. We've missed screenshots of stuff that rabbited later and kicked ourselves so I wanted to have it.
Mir • Jul 11, 2012 @9:33 pm I've been checking these threads and watching the Carreons self-destruct ever since this thing started. (And you all are hilarious, by the way) Watching their reactions now, these two Dean Koontz quotes keep running through my head. (Both quotes are found in From the Corner of His Eye.)
“The problem with movies and books is they make evil look glamorous, exciting, when it’s no such thing. It’s boring and it’s depressing and it’s stupid. (They) are shallow, empty, boring people who couldn’t give you five minutes of interesting conversation if you had the piss-poor luck to be at a party full of them."
"When you're as hollow as Enoch Kane, the emptiness aches. He's desperate to fill it, but he doesn't have the patience or the commitment to fill it with anything worthwhile… So a man like Kane obsesses on one thing after another…anything that seems to give meaning to his days, but that requires no real self-discovery or self-sacrifice."
I'm not saying the Carreons are evil necessarily, but IMO they are certainly behaving as if they were hollow….
Adam Steinbaugh • Jul 11, 2012 @9:36 pm Wil Wheaton just incited the entire internet to hack my Twitter feed and fill it with lots of tweets. You guys know any reputable lawyers?
W Ross • Jul 11, 2012 @9:42 pm Just Charles.
So no, not any reputable ones.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 11, 2012 @9:43 pm Adam: Better Call Saul!
W Ross • Jul 11, 2012 @9:45 pm *Points at Adam* 25 retweets already. Hope your ready to get your blog read. You've just been outted as a Very Interesting Internet Person (VIIP) and will now be slaughtered by a tidal wave of 160 character love.
LULZ I SAY! I $#$%ING TOLD YOU GUYS THIS WOULD HAPPEN…
ahem… carry on.
(You should have worn a hoodie. It's the thieves cowl of the digital age.)
Jeff S • Jul 11, 2012 @9:49 pm Oh no!! Adam! Hold on tight for the DOS!!
Mir • Jul 11, 2012 @9:51 pm I knew there was a reason I still hung around. This is better than a television show. *eat popcorn quietly in the corner*
Mir • Jul 11, 2012 @9:53 pm *eats
That was a description, not an order.
Chris R. • Jul 11, 2012 @9:53 pm My favorite part is him making fun of my abandoned wordpress sites. Which I stopped working on after I decided I wasn't any good at making desktop wallpapers after 4 days. I am pretty sure I didn't get any comments on my satirical charles page within the first 4 days either.
Robert White • Jul 11, 2012 @9:54 pm Note the the Crowd: You should take any link and put ".nyud.net" at the end of the host part of a link if you would like to
(a) be polite to a site owner who isn't scaled up to support extra hits.
(b) have a better than average chance of not showing up as a "hit" in any logs.
This .nyud.net is the "coral cache" (http://www.coralcdn.org/) service that caches and forwards content to reduce and distribute load for any web page.
So for example (using my site as an example because I _refuse_ to link at those tards in any way) "http://verusvoxvocis.org/WinterDark.html" becomes "http://verusvoxvocis.org.nyud.net/WinterDark.html".
So too for all these Carreon sites. If you add and use that then you can watch the ass-hat sites without DOSing and _usually_ without directly visiting the site. (it will turn into a direct visit redirect on occasion).
Elegy • Jul 11, 2012 @9:55 pm @W Ross
I'm in to win it. I outed my real meta-identity earlier on this thread, and I'm here until Ken and Patrick get tired of us and start closing comments on all the Carreon threads.
Heck, I even went and got a gravatar.
W Ross • Jul 11, 2012 @9:58 pm "The Rapeutationists in the Inman-Carreon-Oatmeal Affair are a mixed bag of people who apparently can’t find any real issues of importance to focus their attention upon, and have thus devoted themselves to licking Matt Inman’s hindquarters. There’s no rhyme or reason to their involvement, and some have already harvested so many clicks from the fiasco, that I suggest we proceed in reverse order, from the obscure foot-soldiers to the royalty of Rapeutationists. And all of you, please be patient. In the fullness of time, you will find yourselves revealed here."
There's the official threat in the "raeputationists" thread.
Again, in a rare moment of seriousness, this shit has gotten real, and if you're in here, they may try to embarass you.
That being said…
/steps up on soapbox
Tara, I don't need you to embarrass me on the Internet.
I'm 31 and I'm divorced. A few years ago I had to go to a psychiatric hospital for a suicidal plan (self checked in, but true.) I'm a treated Bipolar with Severe ADHD and social anxiety, and I do spend a lot of my time on the computer. I'm not fat, but I could lose a few, and I've had relationships I'm not proud of. My parents will be a dead hole, my mom is battling stage three cancer and my dad… lol my dad is everything I wish I could be and am not. I'm a satirist, so I've probably told my share of off color jokes and those can be found a lot of places. I don't have a "real job" (I write novels and satire and for magazines, but hardly full time) and I often don't finish what I start, and often say the wrong thing in social situations which makes me awkward and weird in person.
Oh, and I snore.
The point is there ain't shit you can say to threaten me in regards to "outting me on the Internet," because I'm not embarrassed to be me and I'm not frightened of Sea Hags.
Suck it,
Will Goddamned Ross of Omaha Motherfucking Nebraska
Mike K • Jul 11, 2012 @10:01 pm This may be a stupid question but… wouldn't a typical person (especially a lawyer) want to read all the information about a lawsuit against himself immediately?
I mean, as soon as I was served with the papers I would read them through immediately. I wouldn't be wasting the time (over a week) building a site (how does it take that long to build anyway?) about how people were violating my rights (not that many are) and researching their families in an attempt to hurt them.
Elegy • Jul 11, 2012 @10:05 pm @Mike K
You forgot about the horrible video
Gal • Jul 11, 2012 @10:05 pm @Tali: Gratz!
@W Ross: Apart from anything else, the more people he goes after, the greater the chances of someone filing an anti SLAPP suit, are they not?
Also, his proposed tort is insane. Ken hit the nail on the head when he pointed out that the more objectionable an act is, the more likely it is that simply pointing it out would lead to an "internet mobbing."
W Ross • Jul 11, 2012 @10:06 pm @Mike K At this point we can't be rightly sure what they're doing, lol. But I do know if Wil Wheaton is mentioning it to people, it will be expensive, bandwidth wise.
Let them build their audacious little Temple to the Illuminati… The bandwidth costs will bury them, because the more salacious it is the more traffic it'll get- the more news stories it will cause- and the stronger the Streisand Effect will become.
You don't beat Charles Carreon….
Charles Carreon beats Charles Carreon.
Elegy • Jul 11, 2012 @10:12 pm @Gal
I doubt Carreon will face professional censure over this. Nor do I think he should.
What has he done? Sent a strong arm complaint letter; this douchebaggey, but that is something that is done with regularity.
He has filed one frivolous suit (the Inman suit), ok two if you count the guy in Florida in 2003.
Satirical Charles preemptively filed counter-suit on him.
Oh yeah, he's making a public spectacle and giant ass on himself. Certainly this isn't making the other lawyers happy, no doubt they'll be the butt of more jokes, but then again you get these sorts of people in every field. It's his constitutional right to make as big of an ass of himself as he can.
I just don't see yanking his professional certification over this. Partially, that seems too extreme. His rep is already ruined, and he'll never live down the infamy.
M. • Jul 11, 2012 @10:14 pm Anyone want to give a synopsis?
Robert White • Jul 11, 2012 @10:20 pm Please don't use that -stupid- word. You are just validating him.
W Ross • Jul 11, 2012 @10:21 pm @Elegy I'm just tired of all the threats and the bullying from the Wicked Witch of the Southwest and the Arazona SIDS. From day three they've been implying "if you keep paying attention to us in ways we don't approve of, you might get sued." I don't care if he's professionally censured or not, I just hope the world knows the story when he does it.
W Ross • Jul 11, 2012 @10:22 pm *"it" being whatever he does
Gal • Jul 11, 2012 @10:22 pm @Elegy: I agree that he hasn't done enough to face censure yet (except perhaps for legal fees, unless I'm mistaken this nonsense did cost California taxpayers some money.) But it seems he hasn't given up on Doe Hunting. And if he does continue with that then yes, I do believe he should face censure.
Matt Scott • Jul 11, 2012 @10:27 pm God, you work way too many hours for a few days and come home (after some sleep) to a big 'ol Carreon present.
@Chris- Carreon doesn't seem to realize that Satirizing him really shouldn't take all that much time… a lot of rehashing what the man says himself, plus some dinos, some dick drawings (which I'm planning on making the background of my girlfriends computer when she's not looking), and boom, you have a kickass website.
W Ross • Jul 11, 2012 @10:32 pm http://charles-carreon.com/2012/07/11/i ... -i-say-so/
n o 0 n e • Jul 12, 2012 @1:25 am @w ross –
i will now have chap-hop in my pocket wherever i go thanks to Professor Element and your off hand recommendation.
also, thanks for taking to the soapbox, your bravery and anns and nibors and etc. (i'm not dissing, it's just that the list would be long) has made this and all of the other CC related threads here a joy and an education to read.
so, to go further and emulate at least a minor hero. . .
i'm 41 and i'm married.
a year ago i had to go to a hospital for a detox (alcohol – self checked in, but true.)
i'm a recovering alcohol addict who has escaped the places where i abused, and i do spend a lot of my time on my farm.
i'm not fat now, but i was really getting there – i've lost 11 kg since i moved to japan, stopped abusing, and changed my diet and routines.
and i've had relationships i'm not proud of.
family info redacted since they are all well and kicking.
i don't have a "real job" (i am the benificiary of an accident settlement [on a bike hit by a car that ran a stop sign] that thanks to a good lawyer has my savings set while i am living off of a wife that wants to work while i try to fit in to a new society.)
and i while i do finish what i start, i generally don't start much.
oh, and i really fucking snore.
my bravery ends here. gomen nasai.
many thanks (and infinite apologies) to @W Ross
LaserGuy • Jul 12, 2012 @2:26 am OK, my first time posting here, hopefully I don't screw it up too badly!
@Mike K I saw that too. Guess he's getting revenge. I wonder if that's kosher? (Probably is, I can't imagine he'd give Levy any ammo.)
IMHO, it appears that in the E-MAIL sent to Register.Com, he requested the disclosure of privileged and personal information regarding a private registration, based on the representation that this information was to be used specifically to add said person as a named defendant in an existing federal lawsuit -
"Tomorrow I am going to amend the Complaint to allege a claim for cybersquatting in violation of the ACPA, with a prayer for imposition of the maximum $100,000 statutory penalty against fictitiously-named Defendant Doe 2.
I hereby request that, prior to 3 p.m. PST on Friday June 22,2012, Register.com:
…
3) Disclose the Private Registrant's name and contact information to me…
If Register.com discloses the identity of the Private Registrant prior to 3 p.m., I will name the Private Registrant as Doe 2 in the First Amended Complaint. If Register.com fails to disclose the identity of Private Registration by the 3 p.m. deadline, I will be forced to name Register.com as Doe 2 in the First Amended Complaint."
He didn't say "Hey, Register.Com – can you please give me this guy's confidential info, so I can dig into his personal life, and then launch a vindictive personal attack against him and his family on a new web site?!"
This is outrageous! Given that he is an officer of the court, I would think (or at least hope) that misusing his position in such a manner would be a serious ethical breach?
Someone needs to contact the state bar about this.
I am particularly disturbed by his linking to a page with a picture of CD's wife apparently holding their young child, which he then follows with the bone-chilling comment -
"But there are no innocents in war."
WTF?!!! Was that a threat?!
Register.Com also has some MAJOR egg on their face on this one – I wonder if they realize just how the information they "coughed up" for him is now being used?
That's a news story in and of itself.
Given the "disturbing" nature of some of what he was posting, I did a little checking on who was hosting his new site. While the WhoIs info is pointing to an offshore privacy service located in Australia, the site itself appears to be hosted at BlueHost.com.
Given the content of that site, you might find this hosting company's TOS rather interesting -
http://www.bluehost.com/cgi/info/terms.html
Particularly Section "10. PROHIBITED USES", which includes…
04 – appears to prohibit profanity.
05 – "Private Information and Images. Subscribers may not post or disclose any personal or private information about or images of children or any third party without the consent of said party (or a parent's consent in the case of a minor)."
13 – Other Illegal Activities, including – "failure to comply with applicable on-line privacy laws".
14 – "Obscene, Defamatory, Abusive or Threatening Language. Use of the Services to store, post, transmit, display or otherwise make available obscene, defamatory, harassing, abusive or threatening language is prohibited."
16 – Other Activities, includes anything that harms, or threatens to harm, the hosting company's reputation or goodwill.
If you know of any site they are hosting that is in violation of their TOS, you might want to contact them and let them know about it.
S. Weasel • Jul 12, 2012 @4:11 am I'm coming 'round to the idea the Carreons are just a pair of sad old acid casualties. Which makes this whole business a lot less fun.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 12, 2012 @6:40 am LaserGuy: Charles is an asshole, but I don't think he's done anything that should be considered a violation of BlueHosts's terms of service.
Let the loony rant.
Allen C • Jul 12, 2012 @7:04 am This all suddenly becomes clear. When Carreon worked for Sweet Entertainment (a Canadian company) he finalized a lawsuit against an American company that has stolen some of Sweet's media.
He takes the money and puts it in a trust. He was not supposed to do this, his orders were to deliver it to Sweet Entertainment. He then withdraws some of the money for personal needs (his condo in Vancouver).
Due to his actions surrounding Sweet Entertainment, Carreon ended up doing a 60 day suspension. I'm not sure if he was ever reinstated in Oregon or that was part of the reason he's in Arizona and filling in Northern Cali.
Suddenly the whole "I want to put Inman's money in a trust" makes a lot of sense.
For sourcing, see here:
http://censoriousdouchebag.files.wordpr ... -p0087.pdf
Scroll down to the the telephone memo written by Lynda Bey-Roode. It's on page 3 of that memo.
Kristen • Jul 12, 2012 @7:13 am Wow I wish all Internet sites were like theirs (apostraphe?); I can read it once, go back several hours later and it's magically different. Here I thought the 'in' thing was to add editing openly so people can see what changes have been made.
I wouldn't be very interesting as a raputationist: stay at home mom of three with two on the Autism Spectrum. I don't have much of an Internet presence, just Twitter. My husband is awesomer than me but it'd be hard to make fun of his for special-needs children iPhone app, unless to joke about it selling hundred of copies in two months* (not a typo).
Low blow to go after Chris' family. BTW, since when is working retail an insult? Taking care of your family, no matter what you have to do is very noble. I work as a waitress when we need the income. There's no shame in that.
*wait, maybe I do want to be a raputationist, Strisand-effect my husband's app, baby!
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 12, 2012 @7:14 am And he also has massive Chutzpah: He threatened to sue the Oregon Bar Association for publishing information about his suspension, a suspension that he agreed to by stipulation!
Nibor • Jul 12, 2012 @7:16 am Does CC knows that there is a difference between a Denial of Service (DoS) attack and a Disk Operating System (DOS) attack.
For those who do not know what this DOS thing is, a little extra (privileged) information out of the sacred and ancient books (and I did write books correct here, spelled without an “e” for I refer to the paper version of a book, which can be found in the building that is called library, on the other floors and rooms than the ones you use the internet PC’s and/or connection) which date from the time before.
Once a long time ago maybe even before you were born , computers were text based and to operate, at that time our mighty al knowing and providing supreme Microsoft, was without the Windows interface, then we (and yes I am that old) used DOS to interact with and operate the computer, just by typing command’s this without the use of a mouse or touchscreen, go and look it up there will be pictures if you are unable to imagining it.
Back to the case at hand, what if the web server CC uses brakes down under the load of 30+ users a minute and reboots to the DOS 3.14 screen ?
Is there a possibility that that is what is happening for that explains he sees that there is a DOS attack? For when you have a DoS attack there will be no notice on your computer that tells you it is so. As far as I understand you can get a message that the traffic is high and the server is not able to answer all requests or that the error buffer is full. But there is not the message “Hey man your under attack from a DoS, use this information to make yourself ridiculous on the internets”
Disclaimer: But this is only me thinking and asking out loud, not stating that these are facts, I don’t want to be a named rapeutationist. Brrr shivering from fear
Elegy • Jul 12, 2012 @7:29 am @LaserGuy
Good post! On one hand, I would say he's definitely violated his TOS. And I would say your point about registrar.com is a fair one, and come to think of it, it is a news story in itself. I mean, litigation is threatened, they cave immediately, and the guy runs off and starts blaring it on the Internet; it should be a lesson to them.
On the other hand, I think Charles should be allowed to rant and rave as much as he likes.
First, it's his constitutional right to make as big of a fool of himself as he wants to. Is this rapeutation campaign improving his real world reputation any? Nope, he's just shooting himself in the foot, again and again. His credibility is now shot, and will remain so because google doesn't forget.
Second, Satirical Charles knew it would come to this when he signed on. Remember, SC waited until AFTER CC named as a co-defendant an Ars Technica reader who was impersonating him on Twitter l. Satirical Charles knew this was coming, before he ever stepped into the ring. Hell, SC is suing CC, which, when you look at it, is the same reason CC is in the spotlight today.
Third, CC is only giving back as good as he gets. Go read back through the hundreds of comments in these threads. We've picked over Charles life with a fine toothed comb. I've looked at his house on google earth, examined his property records and taxes, etc. Put shortly, why can we do it, but he can't? Hell, we go on and on a out his wife (to be fair, she goes on and in about us, too)
Again, I think your point about registrar is a great one – someone really should point out what CC did with the information after they exhibited about as much backbone as cooked pasta.
But, vehemently, the solution here is not to sink to his level, and attempt to get him shut down for TOS violation. That is what HE does.
The solution is to let him make such an ass of himself, so that he has not one ounce of dignity or credibility left, both professionally or personally. The biggest revenge will be to sit back, and lol while he shoots himself in the foot, over and over, in full public view.
Nibor • Jul 12, 2012 @7:30 am @Laserguy here is some extra info on the Registar issue:
First post is with the same rage you are reacting:
http://adamsteinbaugh.com/2012/06/26/di ... s-carreon/
Second post is a reaction after Adam was corrected by Marc Randazza
http://adamsteinbaugh.com/2012/06/27/in ... umble-pie/
But the first thing that happend in the Doe v CC case was a letter from Paul Alan Levy of Public Citizen to Registar which resulted in removing SC identity again. So the first post of Adam wasn't that wrong.
See this popehat article for the letter:
http://www.popehat.com/2012/07/02/oatme ... gets-sued/
What my question is, when a case is filed in name of a J.Doe is it legal for the acused to publicly name this J.Doe ???
Elegy • Jul 12, 2012 @7:32 am That's "we go on and on about his wife" not "we go on an in his wife".
Ewwwwwwwww.
Damn you autocorrect.
Nibor • Jul 12, 2012 @7:39 am @Elegy an Freudian autocorrect function?
Mike K • Jul 12, 2012 @7:41 am The difference on the family issue is that noone looked into his family at all until they started to say stupid things in their own right. The daughters are barely mentioned, and usually when they are it's somewhat sympathetic. The wife is talked about on the merits of her conspiracy theories. CC is apparently willing to bring in family members of people he sees as attacking him for the sole reason of being related to that 'attacker'. Otherwise, yes, he's essentially done some of the same kind of research on others that has been done on him, with the exception that most people haven't posted their lives as in depth as he has.
@Nibor Of course we remember DOS systems. Windows 98 still used it, and I remember playing games like hangman and chess on our old Tandy when I was growing up. Then playing with certain games that were more obviously DOS based (including the original Warcraft). For what it's worth, I also remember books although I frequently wished they were electronic. They were the only acceptable form of entertainment for boredom in class.
Nibor • Jul 12, 2012 @7:48 am @laserguy I have made a comment that is linking to different sites on the registar issue, but it's in the awaiting moderation list, I let you know when it get posted.
Elegy • Jul 12, 2012 @7:49 am @nibor
You should see the things autocorrect says to my mom. Talk about Freudian.
And to this day, I still use the cmd prompt in windows more than windows itself. My family's first computer was a 286 DOS machine, with a 20mb hard drive. Computer guy told my dad that "this is a you'll ever need". I believe my dad paid $4500 for it. Consequentially, my brain has moved past DOS, but my soul never will.
Nibor • Jul 12, 2012 @7:57 am I mix them up but I believe it was a 288*, 286, 386, 486, pentium, etc.
But also a commodore 64,128 and amiga.
And even a Z80 for a little while
The good old days.
* I never seem to remember if it was a 2 or a 1 before the 88.
Nibor • Jul 12, 2012 @8:05 am looked it up But it was a 8088, 186, 286, etc
Mike K • Jul 12, 2012 @8:07 am yikes, you guys remember models on all of your old computers? All I remember is Tandy, then various Gateways including an Astro, the Compaq in college (could probably figure out the model, but that's because I did IT on it), and a Dell (only PC I've purchased myself). I don't even remember the model, but then I was more interested in making sure its specs met my needs, specifically 4 GB RAM (it's several years old before that was common). Next thing you'll say is that you've actually seen floppy disks bigger than 5 1/4" or that you remember using modems at speeds less than 256K. :p (not that any of those make you guys old, just surprising things I learned about in the course of computer classes that I never knew about otherwise)
LaserGuy • Jul 12, 2012 @8:07 am @NW: Well, for starters…
"05. Private Information and Images. Subscribers may not post or disclose any personal or private information about or images of children or any third party without the consent of said party (or a parent's consent in the case of a minor)."
So unless you're saying Chris & the others gave him permission, that one seems pretty clear-cut.
Chris also chose to exercise his right to speak anonymously. That's a pretty damn important and constitutionally protected right, going back to the start of our country. It's also a right that Doe vs. Carreon is seeking to protect.
I am therefore quite angry that an atty would misuse their position to gain personal info, in order to then use that to not only deprive Chris of that right by publicly outing (as well as personally attacking) him, but going after Chris's wife and kid as well!
He is also explicitly threatening to do this to others, to intimidate / scare / bully / discourage free speech on this matter by those that don't agree with his tactics. This is what this whole lawsuit is about, remember?
Mike K • Jul 12, 2012 @8:13 am LaserGuy, I'm not sure where he got the pictures from but if he got them from a site that specifically says that by uploading the picture you are allowing others to use the picture, that would be permission. I noticed that Photobucket's ToS included some lines about that, and I suspect that the social networking sites he grabbed them from have similar policies. The name was also made public, rather than being given as privileged information, so while scummy, nothing wrong there. It also seems that the name is hearsay in that Carreon never actually saw the registration info before it reverted to anonymous.
Shannon Lynch • Jul 12, 2012 @8:15 am I actually want to thank Charles Carreon.
Three months ago I went rock climbing and fell off, shattering my right foot into oblivion. I was told I was lucky I just landed on my foot and reminded several times I could have died. So after major surgery, bed rest, struggling to learn how to walk after two months in a wheelchair, and all these fucking horrible things you can imagine how bored and depressed you can get for being confined and useless.
The whole Carreon/Inman debacle definately provides lulz. And it has brought me to laughing tears. I actually will sometimes and go read Tara's rants when I feel discouraged or upset because they are just so out there and loony how do you not cringe from it knowing she is deadpan serious and laugh so hard BECAUSE she is so deadpan serious.
So thank you Carreon for giving a kid perspective here. It doesn't matter if you lose your ability to run, walk, or be a normal physical person again because your voice is what really matters. You can lose anything and everything, but your ability to speak out and say your opinion is worth dieing for.
Of course….you showed it by being a censorious douchebag….but that's besides the point.
Shannon Lynch • Jul 12, 2012 @8:16 am *dying (and all other typos I apologize)
Grifter • Jul 12, 2012 @8:21 am @Nibor/Mike K
I have two words:
Oregon Trail.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 12, 2012 @8:22 am For those who want to get their money worth out of my beer, err, Pacer money:
http://www.archive.org/download/gov.usc ... ocket.html
Is the case which caused the first cited bar complaint, where Charles rushed to the courthouse to try to file first in California, despite the plaintiffs AND defendants being in Maryland.
Forum shopping attempt smacked-down… But hey, it succeeded in allowing him to bond with (and presumably bill) his clients.
Nibor • Jul 12, 2012 @8:24 am @laserguy he (only)linked to a google+ page, so that's totaly legal, for all you put on there is fair game for all and is public, if you don't want that you can shield the info you wish to share. you may not ripp the pictures and info to post elsewhere but linking is allouwd
But it is not nice or decent to do so (to put it pollite), that is true but it is not ilegal
But is I ask myself, it legal that he dicloses J.Doe's name when he is in court deallings with him, where the identity is consealed?
Nibor • Jul 12, 2012 @8:28 am @Grifter sorry was only 5 months at first relase, so I tip my hat and offer you my cain.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 12, 2012 @8:32 am Oh, the other thing thats amusing in Charles's forum shopping attempt. He argues that because ALS scans sold porn subscriptions to Californians, it can then fall under the jurisdiction of the California Courts…
Which is how Penguin is trying to get him to stay in the NY courts in Penguin v American Buddha: sales of Charles's self-published sex.com book.
I think Charles was NEVER a 1st Amendment defender. Rather, he is a very determined advocate for himself/his client. Since he largely represented pornographers, a group which often needs 1st amendment defense, he became a 1st amendment defender. Now that his only client is himself, he's switched around the other way.
Elegy • Jul 12, 2012 @8:39 am @Laserguy
The proper response to butthurt is not to be butthurt in return and attempt to censor Charles as he has attempted to censor the Internet at large. As noted somewhere above, CC is making efforts not to post slanderous and/or libelous commentary. Until he does, he can say all the nasty things – and do all the nasty things – that he likes.
Might I also suggest that if you're serious about Satirical Charles' right to anonymity, you refer to him as Satirical Charles and not by his given name. Yes, the info is out there now, but you don't have to help disseminate it. Just a suggestion, though,
@Nicholas Weaver
Thanks again for using your beer money to finance my Carreon fixes. Shame it's just the docket though, would love to see the original complaint (don't go rush off and spend real moneys on it!). We could start a crowd sourced indiegogo project for you, but you might get sued.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 12, 2012 @8:50 am The complaint is up there: THe RECAP docket link includes links to the case files, declarations, etc.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 12, 2012 @8:52 am Also, some of the files aren't in RECAP but should be up soon: it takes a while for it to process documents sometimes.
Elegy • Jul 12, 2012 @8:58 am Awesome, thanks again!
Nibor • Jul 12, 2012 @9:27 am I don`t know but when I look at the raw source data of the rapeutation web site I see something that is a tracking java script
It links to "track dot larkpub dot com" so beware he is tracking his visitors
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 12, 2012 @9:38 am His tracker is hosted on American Buddha's server (track.larkpub.com), so its an in-house tracking solution. However, "Lark Publications" is a non-entity.
Its using http://piwik.org/ open source analytics.
This analytics should allow Charles to easily see if his DOS complaint is false, by seeing where the referrers come from and that the "DOS" he got was simply Ars and others pointing to rapeutation.com
Chris R. • Jul 12, 2012 @9:40 am @Nibor he's definitely using pwiki analytics, which is being run on the larkpub site. Probably just logging location and ip. Which is fairly standard for any wordpress installation.
Chris R. • Jul 12, 2012 @9:44 am @Nicholas, I doubt his claims are relevant since the site hasn't gone down since the first day it was linked to often. Further more he claims proof but then doesn't present it. If he had a log, he could just dump it and it'd be settled.
Matthew • Jul 12, 2012 @9:47 am The "tracking" is just web analytics, same as pretty much every site on the web has the capability of doing (and a lot do).
Having that on his website isn't particularly nefarious and doesn't allow him to identify visitors (that would require ISPs to give up details of IP addresses, which they aren't going to do). I can't honestly see anything to beware of here.
Details of the software involved:
http://piwik.org/
Matthew • Jul 12, 2012 @9:49 am And this is the specific WordPress pluging he's using:
http://www.braekling.de/wp-piwik-wpmu-piwik-wordpress
It could easily be part of the template he's chosen.
Mike K • Jul 11, 2012 @6:06 pm I was figuring that by 'Wikipedia Clique' he was referring to the editors that were going to delete his page. I'm assuming they'll be renewing that discussion again shortly, unless he does something so worthy of scorn as to merit it on his wikipedia page and saving it for a while.
n o 0 n e • Jul 11, 2012 @6:10 pm @W Ross
thank you for introducing me to Professor Elemental. despite my love for hip-hop and things with a wodehousian flair i was unaware of this fine gentlemen or the expressive genre known as 'chap-hop' that so effusively combines the two.
upon my sam, i am in your debt.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 11, 2012 @6:10 pm T.J: Because they don't have Arizona council.
Carreon is very good (and probably right, actually, in this case) at fighting jurisdictional claims. The RIAA would need to sue in Arizona or California, or Carreon would tie them up forever in court on jurisdiction (Penguin v American Buddha is still in the appeals process over just that issue).
Myk • Jul 11, 2012 @6:34 pm @T.J @Nicholas – It would be fun, though, if RIAA were to launch a raid akin to the Kim Dotcom one- armed agents rappelling from helicopters etc. I would pay money to see the look on Tara's face when that one goes down! I realise it'll never happen, but one can daydream…
Chris R. • Jul 11, 2012 @6:45 pm @Myk, that would probably be tragic because if she still owns her firearms she'd begin firing on police and they'd respond in suit.
Chris R. • Jul 11, 2012 @6:56 pm Charles is going full Tara right now on Rapeutation.com adding pages and names by the buttload.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 11, 2012 @7:18 pm Wow, Charles just went off the deep end here:
Paul Alan Levy, an attorney at Public Citizen Group who is said to be “an expert in issues of Internet free speech, removal jurisdiction, and the representation of ‘lawyers in trouble’ from sanctions, contempt findings and the like,” has sued me on behalf of a “Doe Plaintiff” who, so I hear from third-hand sources, is alleged to be the registrant of Charles-Carreon.com. (For the record – I have never read one line of the complaint.) Paul looks entirely sane, so we can only conclude that the smell of oatmeal is more intoxicating than it might seem. Freedom of speech is at stake! Aux les barricades!
You would think he'd actually read the complaint by now.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 11, 2012 @7:20 pm Oh, and he edits as I read!
Of course, the real question is, will Paul represent Mr. Recovreur if Walgreens fires him for unauthorized use of his workplace computer? Paul looks entirely sane, so we can only conclude that the smell of oatmeal is more intoxicating than it might seem.
Chris R. • Jul 11, 2012 @7:37 pm Lol. 2 blog posts a day = has to use work computer? It must take him a real long time to write things down.
Mike K • Jul 11, 2012 @7:37 pm I expect Ken will be listed eventually. You should write your own paragraph and send it to him. Then you can practice your snark and and save him a few hours of research.
I notice that other than a few grammar mistakes that he's being very careful about what he writes. He's avoiding anything that could be remotely considered defamatory, although it's pretty bad that he'd mention someone's wife as part of his 'war' despite her presumably not mentioning his name ever.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 11, 2012 @7:44 pm Mike K: Yeah.
And hey, it IS protected, he can rant and rave as much as he wants. Its amusing to a large degree, but by the same token we can taunt him and taunt him and taunt him…
The "at work" comment even can probably be classed as opinion, and therefore protected. Just because the Real Chuckles may think it takes 4 billable hours to do a post (lawyers work slow, especially when they are happy things don't settle because it gives them a chance to bond with their clients and bill them more!), doesn't mean Satirical Charles does.
Ann • Jul 11, 2012 @7:49 pm Yeah. So any pity that may have been seeding itself in my southern sensibilities for that piece of shit just got squished w/ the mention of Chris' wife. The only members of the Carreon clan that have been discussed have been those who have inserted themselves into the conversation.
Referring to this as a war is preposterous. That said, it is now on like Donkey Kong.
Marzipan • Jul 11, 2012 @7:54 pm Indeed, Ann. Seems like he's trying to drag in the family of all his critics as he views his family as having been dragged in.
Truth be told, I'm surprised he hasn't included you for being…what was it, the "Lying Little Bitch"?…who started another fundraiser with the explicit purpose of demonstrating FU is a perfectly legitimate reason for donating money. Who else here will end up on his hit list…err…"Rapeutationers" list?
joe • Jul 11, 2012 @7:55 pm Nicholas, Ann, where is he posting this – can you provide the link?
Shannon Lynch • Jul 11, 2012 @7:58 pm http://rapeutation.com/2012/07/12/the-rapeutationists/
Adam Steinbaugh • Jul 11, 2012 @8:00 pm I'm not surprised by the creepiness of bringing in Chris' wife. When Carreon and I talked via Twitter DMs, he asked me if I had any allegiances, claiming he didn't have time to research me. A few minutes later, he asked what a particular professor I'd worked for (on First Amendment issues) would say about his case. I checked my IP logs and confirmed that he had downloaded my resume. So much for having no time to research.
Elegy • Jul 11, 2012 @8:00 pm Yeah, I can't find the list of enemies from his main site, all links appear to have been taken off. Perhaps you guys are reading something he thinks is protected?
Link Please!
Elegy • Jul 11, 2012 @8:00 pm In late, sorry, thanks for the link.
Marzipan • Jul 11, 2012 @8:05 pm @Adam, yeesh. Sounds like he's been doing the Creep. I wish he would have taken his own advice: "Might have a career ahead of him if he learns that the smell of fecal matter is actually a warning of potential toxicity, not a signal to drive your snout deeply into the source of the aroma."
Then again, after lying around in it for decades, I'm sure his intellectual sniffer has habituated to the stink of fetid arguments, no matter how forcefully he advances them.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 11, 2012 @8:05 pm Adam: Hey, look at it this way, you're first on Carreon's parade, you should be honored!
I'm dissapointed, all my PACER money and, for what, cool quotes like
Far from being worried, Mr. Carreon stated that he was pleased that negotiations had not proved successful because it allowed him to “bond with [his] clients and get more money out of them.”
(Declaration of ROBERT L. LOMBARDO, in Global Innovations, Inc. et al v. ALS Scan, Inc. et al)
Ann • Jul 11, 2012 @8:07 pm @Adam – he's back on Twitter?????
Adam Steinbaugh • Jul 11, 2012 @8:10 pm @Ann: no, this was when he originally filed against Inman. He had followed me on Twitter, so I DM'd him asking for a copy of the complaint. He didn't oblige.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 11, 2012 @8:13 pm Oh, adam, Carreon's claiming to have evidence of an evil DOS attack on him:
http://rapeutation.com/evidence-of-dos-attacks/
Elegy • Jul 11, 2012 @8:14 pm And…. I found the link to that post – got a little over excited at the douchebaggery there, won't happen again.
What is bizarre to me is this: from its initial launch, I thought "Rapeutation.com" was going to be Charles way of introducing a serious discussion of what he (perceived) to be the faults of current tort law – despite the bizarre fonts and colors, and distinct lack of capitalization in his "legal analysis".
Instead, he's sunk to extremely personal attacks against the people he thinks are after him in something like 72-hours or less. This only serves to undercut any high ground he could hope to hold, and it reveals his douchebaggery in all its glory. This guy is a foot-shot Olympian.
I'm just waiting on him to start jumping on 4chan. They were on his list of rapeutationists earlier. Hopefully they'll jump up and down on him instead. (Ok, on second thought, I wouldn't wish that on anyone)
Adam Steinbaugh • Jul 11, 2012 @8:23 pm @Nicholas: I saw. I'm waiting for something to get posted. If he's right, then he's right. I've already said that if those kinds of attacks are happening, then that's despicable.
Say, you have a tech background, yes?
@Elegy: indeed. Here I thought he might use the site to bring a unique perspective on how we should approach the First Amendment in the Internet context. Then again, the site's name is a rape pun playing off of reputation.com.
W Ross • Jul 11, 2012 @8:27 pm Wow….
The Carreons are the Endboss of the Internet.
I never thought I'd see it in my day…
Ken • Jul 11, 2012 @8:28 pm I'm betting that I find out that I'm bald and fat, and possibly stupid.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 11, 2012 @8:28 pm Adam: Yeah. Ph.D. Computer Science, specializing in network measurement and network security.
If it is an actual DOS, rather than a flashcrowd and curious people hitting reload, that his system is back up says its just some script kiddies with something like LOIC, which means if it is a real DOS, he could probably track them down pretty easily because anyone who would do such a weak-sauce DOS is probably stupid enough to do it from their own home system.
And I would be willing to help him on that, on a pro bono basis. Even reprehensible douchebags deserve free speech rights on their own site.
Ken • Jul 11, 2012 @8:30 pm Agreed. A DOS is not free speech. I have zero problem with douchebags doing that being outed, tracked down, and reported to anyone who will listen.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 11, 2012 @8:34 pm ken: I suspect Carreon won't be so classy. Expect something dissing your family. That seems more his style.
Oh, and Adam, he's surprised people notice him!
Almost immediately after I posted this comment on July 11, 2012, Adam responded with a tweet that appeared on his own blog, posting a link back here. The dynamics of DIRAs generate strange attractors.
Adam Steinbaugh • Jul 11, 2012 @8:41 pm I confess that I'm not nearly nerdy enough to understand what that means.
(not the DOS description — that I understand crystal clear, and I join in your offer to help track down the malcontents.)
Elegy • Jul 11, 2012 @8:43 pm @Adam
You're right, I should have said multiple foot-shot champion. He was sunk from the point he picked the domain name.
I was hoping that the mudwrestling comment was signaling the "aw shucks, let's let bygone be bygones/we were all just kidding" phase. Instead, the man starts piling on the crazy, Tara style. Good god.
I wasn't really ready to buy into the "conflating rape with what he's going through" argument at first – I just figured it was evidence of poor taste and little thought on his part.
But damned if I don't buy it now. I think the man's butthurt has gotten so bad, it is evident that he really feels he is being "raped".
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 11, 2012 @8:45 pm Translation:
"Script Kiddies": Think the cliche pimply-faced asshole living in Mama's basement. Cliche, but true. Tends to use off the shelf tools (scripts), thus the derogatory term.
LOIC: "Low Orbit Ion Cannon": "Anonymous's" simple DDoS tool, but it by default is running from the user's computer. Thus its pretty easy to track down who's using it.
Grifter • Jul 11, 2012 @8:47 pm Wait, Adam, were you questioning the DOS stuff, or the strange attractor accusation?
W Ross • Jul 11, 2012 @8:48 pm @Ken
"In the "Legal Analysis" he says: denial of service attacks (my network has suffered three major dos attacks, and i have quadrupled my server space, at considerable cost, simply to stay online) or other digital trespasses to chattels"
Now go and look at the Nader Library thread here:
http://www.naderlibrary.com/bulletin_bo ... m.php?f=24
And note the 100,000 reads she's gotten in just the first two articles. If he's got DOS stuff then yeah, release it and throw the book. But I'm guessing his sites went down on high traffic and he had to pay to go to some next tier or something before they turned them back on- counting to him as the site being knocked off line.
In that case, it's the salacious speech that's causing the traffic, not somebody firing mad packets at it. That's my guess.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 11, 2012 @8:51 pm W Ross: That's my bet too.
The failures have been "Can't connect to database" in some cases, and his main site (the CharlesCarreon domain also hosts rapeutation and his other wonders. But its all database driven, and probably on a pretty dinky VM hosting through BlueHost. And it attracts a lot more traffic than he was used to.
Adam Steinbaugh • Jul 11, 2012 @8:51 pm Oh, no, I get the DOS stuff Weaver's talking about. I used to do some low-level network security stuff for MySpace.
The strange attractor thing, complete with link to this page… no idea.
Grifter • Jul 11, 2012 @8:54 pm @Adam Steinbaugh:
It's a chaos theory thing (that he's misusing). A strange attractor is a point in an equation that other data points "sort of" circle around, causing a sort of linked-looking eddy thing (I'm being very technical), and I believe he's saying you are linked to him like a strange attractor in a system.
He is undoubtedly picturing something like this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lorenz_system
Grifter • Jul 11, 2012 @8:55 pm …which is on the page he linked, if I'd actually read it. I guess he's saying you're his other butterfly wing. It's a…compliment?
Elegy • Jul 11, 2012 @9:00 pm @Adam
That's chaos theory stuff, ever popular with hippies and graduate students who subsist on too much postmodernism. Put simply, it's a point in n-space (or the complex plane, etc) about which certain equations exhibit certain kinds of behavior.
It's difficult to explain in layman's terms and no math, which is why I'm betting Carreon is just using a buzz word. Whatever he thinks it means, it doesn't. But I have no idea what he thinks it means.
Robert White • Jul 11, 2012 @9:06 pm Plus, the whole "butterfly" thing was disproved because of the failure of the "initial condition" hypothesis. That is, the chaos butterfly works only if the universe is static as the initial condition, but because the universe isn't static when the flapping happens, no "resultant" storm.
I'm no math wiz, but I love it when people who are -wholly- clueless use the words to steal cachet.
also, "DOS" my ass, they just aren't used to having anything they said actually read. e.g. "toh noes, someone hit my site, I must be under attack!".
W Ross • Jul 11, 2012 @9:06 pm @Nicholas Weaver Cool, so it's not me. Cause that's a LOT of traffic for a month on a site that gets no traffic. My bet is they were coasting along on a very inexpensive plan, then their sites got popular and the costs went up.
If he's got evidence, he'll show his hand; real evidence of a DOS is usually pretty concrete unless it's sophisticated (in my understanding.)
@noOne You're welcome. Always good to keep a little Chap Hop in your trouser pocket.
@all
/sets up soapbox
OK so we're kind of through the Looking Glass here folks. I want to say here and now that anybody who suddenly goes Anonymous, shuts up, or heads off; I don't blame ya and do what you gotta. Shit is getting real when people start mentioning family members of press and commenters.
If you stay, and if you have a web presence, the Carreon's may subject you to embarrassing disclosures. They may make generalized statements about you in print, or contact your friends and family. They may photoshop a murder of dicks on your forehead (yes, they're like crows.)
If you stay I can't promise you victory… I can't promise you safety, or a delicious ham sandwich… But I can promise you one thing…
lulz.
Dozens and dozens of delightful, memorable, once in a lifetime lulz as you and your newfound friends are viciously attacked by Bellatrix Lestrange and Stephen Segal's half-brother in the most public, failure ridden way possible. You will laugh like you haven't laughed before, and then you will laugh again, because Tara will edit and repost the thing you just laughed at, making it hilarious.
And you'll probably get sued.
So if I never see you again, know I thought you fought bravely on the fields of hilarity, and I was proud to know you.
But if you stay… well, again, probably dicks right on your face.
But it will be funny.
(*required music https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XZIEBZsV9hk )
Ann • Jul 11, 2012 @9:07 pm If he's having database connection issues, could be SQL injection. The Nader Library site is very late nineties in construction and aesthetics. Is it a leap to think the site was utilizing inline selection statements prior to the "attacks" and then some poor website admin had to convert them to stored procedures? SQL injection could be purposeful, or it could be cropping up in the "bot-ish" version now that the site is more easily crawlable with all the inbound links?
W Ross • Jul 11, 2012 @9:11 pm http://rapeutation.com/2012/07/12/hate-emails/
A new section. So you don't "DOS" him with hits, here's the full text so far. Busy little bees, they. This ought to be a night.
"As a Rapeutation gets going, many minor league Rapeutationists start to send hate emails. What is the effect of receiving hate emails, you might ask? It depends upon a lot of things. In The Sex.Com Chronicles, I described the anxiety caused by receiving scary faxes (the instant-delivery technology of the day), and you might think hate emails would cause the same response. But they don’t. As I received and read a few hundred hate emails, I experienced a range of responses. I was mostly amused, occasionally challenged, rarely annoyed, and in the aggregate, somewhat saddened.
Amused because although the writers were familiar with my name, they didn’t know me, so much of what they said seemed silly and misdirected. Challenged when the writer raised a relevant point that seemed worthy of a response. Annoyed for a range of reasons that all amounted one thing — I had let them get under my skin. Saddened because so many people had the time spit bile at me, over a legal spat about comic websites, while the world is literally burning up around us, while American-made drones hunt humans like video-game targets on the other side of the world, while migrants struggle through the desert a few miles south of here in the Sonora desert, just trying to make it to a place where they can have a decent living. In that context, wasting time hatemailing me seemed like a terrible waste of mental energy. But I digress. This post is to give you access to some of the hatemails I received, to put names to some of the hatemailers, and allow you, dear reader, a view into the workings of a DIRA.
THIS PAGE IS NOW UNDER CONSTRUCTION
PREVIOUS : The Rapeutationists"
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 11, 2012 @9:15 pm Ann: Nah. Naderlibrary/american-buddha are hosted on a different server from Charles's "professional" sites. Its the raputation professional site and the other professional sites that have been having issues today.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 11, 2012 @9:18 pm Oh, and if I do get sued, for expressing my constitutionally protected opinions and right to search and publish public records, let it be known I will make sure that the words "Snort my taint" end up in the legal record for the case.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 11, 2012 @9:19 pm Robert: Of course, the goal is to find the butterfly thats causing all the bad weather and KILL IT!
Mike K • Jul 11, 2012 @9:20 pm "while the world is literally burning up"
I loled when I read this on his site.
I have minimal web presence Ross, so I have severe doubts they'll find me without latching onto some other random person. I may do website work, but I'm somewhat anti-social and have a tendency to reveal vague details that don't identify me when online.
W Ross • Jul 11, 2012 @9:22 pm You know that part where the hero rides in on the horse made of Internets?
https://twitter.com/wilw/status/223270342708305920
Well now you do.
Welcome to thunderdome, motherfather. Treebeard just stood up, and he's pissed about how you're treatin' his forest.
(Told you there'd be lulz.)
Tali • Jul 11, 2012 @9:23 pm @W Ross
A Citizen Kane style applause for your soapbox preaching.
http://thumbs.newschoolers.com/index.ph ... /&size=400×1000
I feel like I've missed a lot in the time I've been AFK, but I guess having a baby (and forgetting to pay the internet bill in the process) will do that to you
Now that I'm back, I'm totally with you. I'm in it for the lulz!
W Ross • Jul 11, 2012 @9:25 pm Then remember that part of the movie where yet another hero takes notice?
https://twitter.com/doctorow/status/223270690609053696
>:D
YA DONE GOOFED!
Wil • Jul 11, 2012 @9:29 pm As a professional SQL geek, from what I can tell the Nader Library website is patched and not vulnerable to SQL injection. It's not intentional…they just lucked out. I've done a decent amount of intrusion testing for SQL injection and later versions of most forum software (Vbulletin, PHPbb, etc.) are relatively immune.
W Ross • Jul 11, 2012 @9:32 pm @Wil Nice, so that base is covered.
http://imgur.com/z8182
I got the photo of the site uploaded so they can't delete their way out of it. We've missed screenshots of stuff that rabbited later and kicked ourselves so I wanted to have it.
Mir • Jul 11, 2012 @9:33 pm I've been checking these threads and watching the Carreons self-destruct ever since this thing started. (And you all are hilarious, by the way) Watching their reactions now, these two Dean Koontz quotes keep running through my head. (Both quotes are found in From the Corner of His Eye.)
“The problem with movies and books is they make evil look glamorous, exciting, when it’s no such thing. It’s boring and it’s depressing and it’s stupid. (They) are shallow, empty, boring people who couldn’t give you five minutes of interesting conversation if you had the piss-poor luck to be at a party full of them."
"When you're as hollow as Enoch Kane, the emptiness aches. He's desperate to fill it, but he doesn't have the patience or the commitment to fill it with anything worthwhile… So a man like Kane obsesses on one thing after another…anything that seems to give meaning to his days, but that requires no real self-discovery or self-sacrifice."
I'm not saying the Carreons are evil necessarily, but IMO they are certainly behaving as if they were hollow….
Adam Steinbaugh • Jul 11, 2012 @9:36 pm Wil Wheaton just incited the entire internet to hack my Twitter feed and fill it with lots of tweets. You guys know any reputable lawyers?
W Ross • Jul 11, 2012 @9:42 pm Just Charles.
So no, not any reputable ones.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 11, 2012 @9:43 pm Adam: Better Call Saul!
W Ross • Jul 11, 2012 @9:45 pm *Points at Adam* 25 retweets already. Hope your ready to get your blog read. You've just been outted as a Very Interesting Internet Person (VIIP) and will now be slaughtered by a tidal wave of 160 character love.
LULZ I SAY! I $#$%ING TOLD YOU GUYS THIS WOULD HAPPEN…
ahem… carry on.
(You should have worn a hoodie. It's the thieves cowl of the digital age.)
Jeff S • Jul 11, 2012 @9:49 pm Oh no!! Adam! Hold on tight for the DOS!!
Mir • Jul 11, 2012 @9:51 pm I knew there was a reason I still hung around. This is better than a television show. *eat popcorn quietly in the corner*
Mir • Jul 11, 2012 @9:53 pm *eats
That was a description, not an order.
Chris R. • Jul 11, 2012 @9:53 pm My favorite part is him making fun of my abandoned wordpress sites. Which I stopped working on after I decided I wasn't any good at making desktop wallpapers after 4 days. I am pretty sure I didn't get any comments on my satirical charles page within the first 4 days either.
Robert White • Jul 11, 2012 @9:54 pm Note the the Crowd: You should take any link and put ".nyud.net" at the end of the host part of a link if you would like to
(a) be polite to a site owner who isn't scaled up to support extra hits.
(b) have a better than average chance of not showing up as a "hit" in any logs.
This .nyud.net is the "coral cache" (http://www.coralcdn.org/) service that caches and forwards content to reduce and distribute load for any web page.
So for example (using my site as an example because I _refuse_ to link at those tards in any way) "http://verusvoxvocis.org/WinterDark.html" becomes "http://verusvoxvocis.org.nyud.net/WinterDark.html".
So too for all these Carreon sites. If you add and use that then you can watch the ass-hat sites without DOSing and _usually_ without directly visiting the site. (it will turn into a direct visit redirect on occasion).
Elegy • Jul 11, 2012 @9:55 pm @W Ross
I'm in to win it. I outed my real meta-identity earlier on this thread, and I'm here until Ken and Patrick get tired of us and start closing comments on all the Carreon threads.
Heck, I even went and got a gravatar.
W Ross • Jul 11, 2012 @9:58 pm "The Rapeutationists in the Inman-Carreon-Oatmeal Affair are a mixed bag of people who apparently can’t find any real issues of importance to focus their attention upon, and have thus devoted themselves to licking Matt Inman’s hindquarters. There’s no rhyme or reason to their involvement, and some have already harvested so many clicks from the fiasco, that I suggest we proceed in reverse order, from the obscure foot-soldiers to the royalty of Rapeutationists. And all of you, please be patient. In the fullness of time, you will find yourselves revealed here."
There's the official threat in the "raeputationists" thread.
Again, in a rare moment of seriousness, this shit has gotten real, and if you're in here, they may try to embarass you.
That being said…
/steps up on soapbox
Tara, I don't need you to embarrass me on the Internet.
I'm 31 and I'm divorced. A few years ago I had to go to a psychiatric hospital for a suicidal plan (self checked in, but true.) I'm a treated Bipolar with Severe ADHD and social anxiety, and I do spend a lot of my time on the computer. I'm not fat, but I could lose a few, and I've had relationships I'm not proud of. My parents will be a dead hole, my mom is battling stage three cancer and my dad… lol my dad is everything I wish I could be and am not. I'm a satirist, so I've probably told my share of off color jokes and those can be found a lot of places. I don't have a "real job" (I write novels and satire and for magazines, but hardly full time) and I often don't finish what I start, and often say the wrong thing in social situations which makes me awkward and weird in person.
Oh, and I snore.
The point is there ain't shit you can say to threaten me in regards to "outting me on the Internet," because I'm not embarrassed to be me and I'm not frightened of Sea Hags.
Suck it,
Will Goddamned Ross of Omaha Motherfucking Nebraska
Mike K • Jul 11, 2012 @10:01 pm This may be a stupid question but… wouldn't a typical person (especially a lawyer) want to read all the information about a lawsuit against himself immediately?
I mean, as soon as I was served with the papers I would read them through immediately. I wouldn't be wasting the time (over a week) building a site (how does it take that long to build anyway?) about how people were violating my rights (not that many are) and researching their families in an attempt to hurt them.
Elegy • Jul 11, 2012 @10:05 pm @Mike K
You forgot about the horrible video
Gal • Jul 11, 2012 @10:05 pm @Tali: Gratz!
@W Ross: Apart from anything else, the more people he goes after, the greater the chances of someone filing an anti SLAPP suit, are they not?
Also, his proposed tort is insane. Ken hit the nail on the head when he pointed out that the more objectionable an act is, the more likely it is that simply pointing it out would lead to an "internet mobbing."
W Ross • Jul 11, 2012 @10:06 pm @Mike K At this point we can't be rightly sure what they're doing, lol. But I do know if Wil Wheaton is mentioning it to people, it will be expensive, bandwidth wise.
Let them build their audacious little Temple to the Illuminati… The bandwidth costs will bury them, because the more salacious it is the more traffic it'll get- the more news stories it will cause- and the stronger the Streisand Effect will become.
You don't beat Charles Carreon….
Charles Carreon beats Charles Carreon.
Elegy • Jul 11, 2012 @10:12 pm @Gal
I doubt Carreon will face professional censure over this. Nor do I think he should.
What has he done? Sent a strong arm complaint letter; this douchebaggey, but that is something that is done with regularity.
He has filed one frivolous suit (the Inman suit), ok two if you count the guy in Florida in 2003.
Satirical Charles preemptively filed counter-suit on him.
Oh yeah, he's making a public spectacle and giant ass on himself. Certainly this isn't making the other lawyers happy, no doubt they'll be the butt of more jokes, but then again you get these sorts of people in every field. It's his constitutional right to make as big of an ass of himself as he can.
I just don't see yanking his professional certification over this. Partially, that seems too extreme. His rep is already ruined, and he'll never live down the infamy.
M. • Jul 11, 2012 @10:14 pm Anyone want to give a synopsis?
Robert White • Jul 11, 2012 @10:20 pm Please don't use that -stupid- word. You are just validating him.
W Ross • Jul 11, 2012 @10:21 pm @Elegy I'm just tired of all the threats and the bullying from the Wicked Witch of the Southwest and the Arazona SIDS. From day three they've been implying "if you keep paying attention to us in ways we don't approve of, you might get sued." I don't care if he's professionally censured or not, I just hope the world knows the story when he does it.
W Ross • Jul 11, 2012 @10:22 pm *"it" being whatever he does
Gal • Jul 11, 2012 @10:22 pm @Elegy: I agree that he hasn't done enough to face censure yet (except perhaps for legal fees, unless I'm mistaken this nonsense did cost California taxpayers some money.) But it seems he hasn't given up on Doe Hunting. And if he does continue with that then yes, I do believe he should face censure.
Matt Scott • Jul 11, 2012 @10:27 pm God, you work way too many hours for a few days and come home (after some sleep) to a big 'ol Carreon present.
@Chris- Carreon doesn't seem to realize that Satirizing him really shouldn't take all that much time… a lot of rehashing what the man says himself, plus some dinos, some dick drawings (which I'm planning on making the background of my girlfriends computer when she's not looking), and boom, you have a kickass website.
W Ross • Jul 11, 2012 @10:32 pm http://charles-carreon.com/2012/07/11/i ... -i-say-so/
n o 0 n e • Jul 12, 2012 @1:25 am @w ross –
i will now have chap-hop in my pocket wherever i go thanks to Professor Element and your off hand recommendation.
also, thanks for taking to the soapbox, your bravery and anns and nibors and etc. (i'm not dissing, it's just that the list would be long) has made this and all of the other CC related threads here a joy and an education to read.
so, to go further and emulate at least a minor hero. . .
i'm 41 and i'm married.
a year ago i had to go to a hospital for a detox (alcohol – self checked in, but true.)
i'm a recovering alcohol addict who has escaped the places where i abused, and i do spend a lot of my time on my farm.
i'm not fat now, but i was really getting there – i've lost 11 kg since i moved to japan, stopped abusing, and changed my diet and routines.
and i've had relationships i'm not proud of.
family info redacted since they are all well and kicking.
i don't have a "real job" (i am the benificiary of an accident settlement [on a bike hit by a car that ran a stop sign] that thanks to a good lawyer has my savings set while i am living off of a wife that wants to work while i try to fit in to a new society.)
and i while i do finish what i start, i generally don't start much.
oh, and i really fucking snore.
my bravery ends here. gomen nasai.
many thanks (and infinite apologies) to @W Ross
LaserGuy • Jul 12, 2012 @2:26 am OK, my first time posting here, hopefully I don't screw it up too badly!
@Mike K I saw that too. Guess he's getting revenge. I wonder if that's kosher? (Probably is, I can't imagine he'd give Levy any ammo.)
IMHO, it appears that in the E-MAIL sent to Register.Com, he requested the disclosure of privileged and personal information regarding a private registration, based on the representation that this information was to be used specifically to add said person as a named defendant in an existing federal lawsuit -
"Tomorrow I am going to amend the Complaint to allege a claim for cybersquatting in violation of the ACPA, with a prayer for imposition of the maximum $100,000 statutory penalty against fictitiously-named Defendant Doe 2.
I hereby request that, prior to 3 p.m. PST on Friday June 22,2012, Register.com:
…
3) Disclose the Private Registrant's name and contact information to me…
If Register.com discloses the identity of the Private Registrant prior to 3 p.m., I will name the Private Registrant as Doe 2 in the First Amended Complaint. If Register.com fails to disclose the identity of Private Registration by the 3 p.m. deadline, I will be forced to name Register.com as Doe 2 in the First Amended Complaint."
He didn't say "Hey, Register.Com – can you please give me this guy's confidential info, so I can dig into his personal life, and then launch a vindictive personal attack against him and his family on a new web site?!"
This is outrageous! Given that he is an officer of the court, I would think (or at least hope) that misusing his position in such a manner would be a serious ethical breach?
Someone needs to contact the state bar about this.
I am particularly disturbed by his linking to a page with a picture of CD's wife apparently holding their young child, which he then follows with the bone-chilling comment -
"But there are no innocents in war."
WTF?!!! Was that a threat?!
Register.Com also has some MAJOR egg on their face on this one – I wonder if they realize just how the information they "coughed up" for him is now being used?
That's a news story in and of itself.
Given the "disturbing" nature of some of what he was posting, I did a little checking on who was hosting his new site. While the WhoIs info is pointing to an offshore privacy service located in Australia, the site itself appears to be hosted at BlueHost.com.
Given the content of that site, you might find this hosting company's TOS rather interesting -
http://www.bluehost.com/cgi/info/terms.html
Particularly Section "10. PROHIBITED USES", which includes…
04 – appears to prohibit profanity.
05 – "Private Information and Images. Subscribers may not post or disclose any personal or private information about or images of children or any third party without the consent of said party (or a parent's consent in the case of a minor)."
13 – Other Illegal Activities, including – "failure to comply with applicable on-line privacy laws".
14 – "Obscene, Defamatory, Abusive or Threatening Language. Use of the Services to store, post, transmit, display or otherwise make available obscene, defamatory, harassing, abusive or threatening language is prohibited."
16 – Other Activities, includes anything that harms, or threatens to harm, the hosting company's reputation or goodwill.
If you know of any site they are hosting that is in violation of their TOS, you might want to contact them and let them know about it.
S. Weasel • Jul 12, 2012 @4:11 am I'm coming 'round to the idea the Carreons are just a pair of sad old acid casualties. Which makes this whole business a lot less fun.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 12, 2012 @6:40 am LaserGuy: Charles is an asshole, but I don't think he's done anything that should be considered a violation of BlueHosts's terms of service.
Let the loony rant.
Allen C • Jul 12, 2012 @7:04 am This all suddenly becomes clear. When Carreon worked for Sweet Entertainment (a Canadian company) he finalized a lawsuit against an American company that has stolen some of Sweet's media.
He takes the money and puts it in a trust. He was not supposed to do this, his orders were to deliver it to Sweet Entertainment. He then withdraws some of the money for personal needs (his condo in Vancouver).
Due to his actions surrounding Sweet Entertainment, Carreon ended up doing a 60 day suspension. I'm not sure if he was ever reinstated in Oregon or that was part of the reason he's in Arizona and filling in Northern Cali.
Suddenly the whole "I want to put Inman's money in a trust" makes a lot of sense.
For sourcing, see here:
http://censoriousdouchebag.files.wordpr ... -p0087.pdf
Scroll down to the the telephone memo written by Lynda Bey-Roode. It's on page 3 of that memo.
Kristen • Jul 12, 2012 @7:13 am Wow I wish all Internet sites were like theirs (apostraphe?); I can read it once, go back several hours later and it's magically different. Here I thought the 'in' thing was to add editing openly so people can see what changes have been made.
I wouldn't be very interesting as a raputationist: stay at home mom of three with two on the Autism Spectrum. I don't have much of an Internet presence, just Twitter. My husband is awesomer than me but it'd be hard to make fun of his for special-needs children iPhone app, unless to joke about it selling hundred of copies in two months* (not a typo).
Low blow to go after Chris' family. BTW, since when is working retail an insult? Taking care of your family, no matter what you have to do is very noble. I work as a waitress when we need the income. There's no shame in that.
*wait, maybe I do want to be a raputationist, Strisand-effect my husband's app, baby!
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 12, 2012 @7:14 am And he also has massive Chutzpah: He threatened to sue the Oregon Bar Association for publishing information about his suspension, a suspension that he agreed to by stipulation!
Nibor • Jul 12, 2012 @7:16 am Does CC knows that there is a difference between a Denial of Service (DoS) attack and a Disk Operating System (DOS) attack.
For those who do not know what this DOS thing is, a little extra (privileged) information out of the sacred and ancient books (and I did write books correct here, spelled without an “e” for I refer to the paper version of a book, which can be found in the building that is called library, on the other floors and rooms than the ones you use the internet PC’s and/or connection) which date from the time before.
Once a long time ago maybe even before you were born , computers were text based and to operate, at that time our mighty al knowing and providing supreme Microsoft, was without the Windows interface, then we (and yes I am that old) used DOS to interact with and operate the computer, just by typing command’s this without the use of a mouse or touchscreen, go and look it up there will be pictures if you are unable to imagining it.
Back to the case at hand, what if the web server CC uses brakes down under the load of 30+ users a minute and reboots to the DOS 3.14 screen ?
Is there a possibility that that is what is happening for that explains he sees that there is a DOS attack? For when you have a DoS attack there will be no notice on your computer that tells you it is so. As far as I understand you can get a message that the traffic is high and the server is not able to answer all requests or that the error buffer is full. But there is not the message “Hey man your under attack from a DoS, use this information to make yourself ridiculous on the internets”
Disclaimer: But this is only me thinking and asking out loud, not stating that these are facts, I don’t want to be a named rapeutationist. Brrr shivering from fear
Elegy • Jul 12, 2012 @7:29 am @LaserGuy
Good post! On one hand, I would say he's definitely violated his TOS. And I would say your point about registrar.com is a fair one, and come to think of it, it is a news story in itself. I mean, litigation is threatened, they cave immediately, and the guy runs off and starts blaring it on the Internet; it should be a lesson to them.
On the other hand, I think Charles should be allowed to rant and rave as much as he likes.
First, it's his constitutional right to make as big of a fool of himself as he wants to. Is this rapeutation campaign improving his real world reputation any? Nope, he's just shooting himself in the foot, again and again. His credibility is now shot, and will remain so because google doesn't forget.
Second, Satirical Charles knew it would come to this when he signed on. Remember, SC waited until AFTER CC named as a co-defendant an Ars Technica reader who was impersonating him on Twitter l. Satirical Charles knew this was coming, before he ever stepped into the ring. Hell, SC is suing CC, which, when you look at it, is the same reason CC is in the spotlight today.
Third, CC is only giving back as good as he gets. Go read back through the hundreds of comments in these threads. We've picked over Charles life with a fine toothed comb. I've looked at his house on google earth, examined his property records and taxes, etc. Put shortly, why can we do it, but he can't? Hell, we go on and on a out his wife (to be fair, she goes on and in about us, too)
Again, I think your point about registrar is a great one – someone really should point out what CC did with the information after they exhibited about as much backbone as cooked pasta.
But, vehemently, the solution here is not to sink to his level, and attempt to get him shut down for TOS violation. That is what HE does.
The solution is to let him make such an ass of himself, so that he has not one ounce of dignity or credibility left, both professionally or personally. The biggest revenge will be to sit back, and lol while he shoots himself in the foot, over and over, in full public view.
Nibor • Jul 12, 2012 @7:30 am @Laserguy here is some extra info on the Registar issue:
First post is with the same rage you are reacting:
http://adamsteinbaugh.com/2012/06/26/di ... s-carreon/
Second post is a reaction after Adam was corrected by Marc Randazza
http://adamsteinbaugh.com/2012/06/27/in ... umble-pie/
But the first thing that happend in the Doe v CC case was a letter from Paul Alan Levy of Public Citizen to Registar which resulted in removing SC identity again. So the first post of Adam wasn't that wrong.
See this popehat article for the letter:
http://www.popehat.com/2012/07/02/oatme ... gets-sued/
What my question is, when a case is filed in name of a J.Doe is it legal for the acused to publicly name this J.Doe ???
Elegy • Jul 12, 2012 @7:32 am That's "we go on and on about his wife" not "we go on an in his wife".
Ewwwwwwwww.
Damn you autocorrect.
Nibor • Jul 12, 2012 @7:39 am @Elegy an Freudian autocorrect function?
Mike K • Jul 12, 2012 @7:41 am The difference on the family issue is that noone looked into his family at all until they started to say stupid things in their own right. The daughters are barely mentioned, and usually when they are it's somewhat sympathetic. The wife is talked about on the merits of her conspiracy theories. CC is apparently willing to bring in family members of people he sees as attacking him for the sole reason of being related to that 'attacker'. Otherwise, yes, he's essentially done some of the same kind of research on others that has been done on him, with the exception that most people haven't posted their lives as in depth as he has.
@Nibor Of course we remember DOS systems. Windows 98 still used it, and I remember playing games like hangman and chess on our old Tandy when I was growing up. Then playing with certain games that were more obviously DOS based (including the original Warcraft). For what it's worth, I also remember books although I frequently wished they were electronic. They were the only acceptable form of entertainment for boredom in class.
Nibor • Jul 12, 2012 @7:48 am @laserguy I have made a comment that is linking to different sites on the registar issue, but it's in the awaiting moderation list, I let you know when it get posted.
Elegy • Jul 12, 2012 @7:49 am @nibor
You should see the things autocorrect says to my mom. Talk about Freudian.
And to this day, I still use the cmd prompt in windows more than windows itself. My family's first computer was a 286 DOS machine, with a 20mb hard drive. Computer guy told my dad that "this is a you'll ever need". I believe my dad paid $4500 for it. Consequentially, my brain has moved past DOS, but my soul never will.
Nibor • Jul 12, 2012 @7:57 am I mix them up but I believe it was a 288*, 286, 386, 486, pentium, etc.
But also a commodore 64,128 and amiga.
And even a Z80 for a little while
The good old days.
* I never seem to remember if it was a 2 or a 1 before the 88.
Nibor • Jul 12, 2012 @8:05 am looked it up But it was a 8088, 186, 286, etc
Mike K • Jul 12, 2012 @8:07 am yikes, you guys remember models on all of your old computers? All I remember is Tandy, then various Gateways including an Astro, the Compaq in college (could probably figure out the model, but that's because I did IT on it), and a Dell (only PC I've purchased myself). I don't even remember the model, but then I was more interested in making sure its specs met my needs, specifically 4 GB RAM (it's several years old before that was common). Next thing you'll say is that you've actually seen floppy disks bigger than 5 1/4" or that you remember using modems at speeds less than 256K. :p (not that any of those make you guys old, just surprising things I learned about in the course of computer classes that I never knew about otherwise)
LaserGuy • Jul 12, 2012 @8:07 am @NW: Well, for starters…
"05. Private Information and Images. Subscribers may not post or disclose any personal or private information about or images of children or any third party without the consent of said party (or a parent's consent in the case of a minor)."
So unless you're saying Chris & the others gave him permission, that one seems pretty clear-cut.
Chris also chose to exercise his right to speak anonymously. That's a pretty damn important and constitutionally protected right, going back to the start of our country. It's also a right that Doe vs. Carreon is seeking to protect.
I am therefore quite angry that an atty would misuse their position to gain personal info, in order to then use that to not only deprive Chris of that right by publicly outing (as well as personally attacking) him, but going after Chris's wife and kid as well!
He is also explicitly threatening to do this to others, to intimidate / scare / bully / discourage free speech on this matter by those that don't agree with his tactics. This is what this whole lawsuit is about, remember?
Mike K • Jul 12, 2012 @8:13 am LaserGuy, I'm not sure where he got the pictures from but if he got them from a site that specifically says that by uploading the picture you are allowing others to use the picture, that would be permission. I noticed that Photobucket's ToS included some lines about that, and I suspect that the social networking sites he grabbed them from have similar policies. The name was also made public, rather than being given as privileged information, so while scummy, nothing wrong there. It also seems that the name is hearsay in that Carreon never actually saw the registration info before it reverted to anonymous.
Shannon Lynch • Jul 12, 2012 @8:15 am I actually want to thank Charles Carreon.
Three months ago I went rock climbing and fell off, shattering my right foot into oblivion. I was told I was lucky I just landed on my foot and reminded several times I could have died. So after major surgery, bed rest, struggling to learn how to walk after two months in a wheelchair, and all these fucking horrible things you can imagine how bored and depressed you can get for being confined and useless.
The whole Carreon/Inman debacle definately provides lulz. And it has brought me to laughing tears. I actually will sometimes and go read Tara's rants when I feel discouraged or upset because they are just so out there and loony how do you not cringe from it knowing she is deadpan serious and laugh so hard BECAUSE she is so deadpan serious.
So thank you Carreon for giving a kid perspective here. It doesn't matter if you lose your ability to run, walk, or be a normal physical person again because your voice is what really matters. You can lose anything and everything, but your ability to speak out and say your opinion is worth dieing for.
Of course….you showed it by being a censorious douchebag….but that's besides the point.
Shannon Lynch • Jul 12, 2012 @8:16 am *dying (and all other typos I apologize)
Grifter • Jul 12, 2012 @8:21 am @Nibor/Mike K
I have two words:
Oregon Trail.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 12, 2012 @8:22 am For those who want to get their money worth out of my beer, err, Pacer money:
http://www.archive.org/download/gov.usc ... ocket.html
Is the case which caused the first cited bar complaint, where Charles rushed to the courthouse to try to file first in California, despite the plaintiffs AND defendants being in Maryland.
Forum shopping attempt smacked-down… But hey, it succeeded in allowing him to bond with (and presumably bill) his clients.
Nibor • Jul 12, 2012 @8:24 am @laserguy he (only)linked to a google+ page, so that's totaly legal, for all you put on there is fair game for all and is public, if you don't want that you can shield the info you wish to share. you may not ripp the pictures and info to post elsewhere but linking is allouwd
But it is not nice or decent to do so (to put it pollite), that is true but it is not ilegal
But is I ask myself, it legal that he dicloses J.Doe's name when he is in court deallings with him, where the identity is consealed?
Nibor • Jul 12, 2012 @8:28 am @Grifter sorry was only 5 months at first relase, so I tip my hat and offer you my cain.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 12, 2012 @8:32 am Oh, the other thing thats amusing in Charles's forum shopping attempt. He argues that because ALS scans sold porn subscriptions to Californians, it can then fall under the jurisdiction of the California Courts…
Which is how Penguin is trying to get him to stay in the NY courts in Penguin v American Buddha: sales of Charles's self-published sex.com book.
I think Charles was NEVER a 1st Amendment defender. Rather, he is a very determined advocate for himself/his client. Since he largely represented pornographers, a group which often needs 1st amendment defense, he became a 1st amendment defender. Now that his only client is himself, he's switched around the other way.
Elegy • Jul 12, 2012 @8:39 am @Laserguy
The proper response to butthurt is not to be butthurt in return and attempt to censor Charles as he has attempted to censor the Internet at large. As noted somewhere above, CC is making efforts not to post slanderous and/or libelous commentary. Until he does, he can say all the nasty things – and do all the nasty things – that he likes.
Might I also suggest that if you're serious about Satirical Charles' right to anonymity, you refer to him as Satirical Charles and not by his given name. Yes, the info is out there now, but you don't have to help disseminate it. Just a suggestion, though,
@Nicholas Weaver
Thanks again for using your beer money to finance my Carreon fixes. Shame it's just the docket though, would love to see the original complaint (don't go rush off and spend real moneys on it!). We could start a crowd sourced indiegogo project for you, but you might get sued.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 12, 2012 @8:50 am The complaint is up there: THe RECAP docket link includes links to the case files, declarations, etc.
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 12, 2012 @8:52 am Also, some of the files aren't in RECAP but should be up soon: it takes a while for it to process documents sometimes.
Elegy • Jul 12, 2012 @8:58 am Awesome, thanks again!
Nibor • Jul 12, 2012 @9:27 am I don`t know but when I look at the raw source data of the rapeutation web site I see something that is a tracking java script
It links to "track dot larkpub dot com" so beware he is tracking his visitors
Nicholas Weaver • Jul 12, 2012 @9:38 am His tracker is hosted on American Buddha's server (track.larkpub.com), so its an in-house tracking solution. However, "Lark Publications" is a non-entity.
Its using http://piwik.org/ open source analytics.
This analytics should allow Charles to easily see if his DOS complaint is false, by seeing where the referrers come from and that the "DOS" he got was simply Ars and others pointing to rapeutation.com
Chris R. • Jul 12, 2012 @9:40 am @Nibor he's definitely using pwiki analytics, which is being run on the larkpub site. Probably just logging location and ip. Which is fairly standard for any wordpress installation.
Chris R. • Jul 12, 2012 @9:44 am @Nicholas, I doubt his claims are relevant since the site hasn't gone down since the first day it was linked to often. Further more he claims proof but then doesn't present it. If he had a log, he could just dump it and it'd be settled.
Matthew • Jul 12, 2012 @9:47 am The "tracking" is just web analytics, same as pretty much every site on the web has the capability of doing (and a lot do).
Having that on his website isn't particularly nefarious and doesn't allow him to identify visitors (that would require ISPs to give up details of IP addresses, which they aren't going to do). I can't honestly see anything to beware of here.
Details of the software involved:
http://piwik.org/
Matthew • Jul 12, 2012 @9:49 am And this is the specific WordPress pluging he's using:
http://www.braekling.de/wp-piwik-wpmu-piwik-wordpress
It could easily be part of the template he's chosen.